Book’em Dano…
July 19, 2010 · By Sean
Then “book” them. No? Lucky bastards, and the tragedy is, they probably don’t understand why.
So the Toronto Police has managed, with overwhelming public support, to identify, locate and arrest 7 more criminals from the G20 Most Wanted List. They have assured the public that the search continues, and they will eventually track down and arrest everyone they are looking for.
So, the newly added names as of July 19th are:
Six men and a male youth are facing mischief charges in connection with property damage inflicting during G20 Summit protests last month….
…Andrew Loughrin, 23, of Toronto, Michael Corbett, 29, of Toronto, Brian O’Handley, 19, of Toronto and Robert Kainola, 24, of Toronto are each facing mischief charges.
Kurt Roarco, 22, of no fixed address is facing a mischief charge, an arson charge and failing to comply with probation.
Jeffrey Delaney, 23, of Toronto is facing a mischief charge and an attempted theft charge.
Of course, under the Youth Criminal Justice Act, anyone under the age of 18 can’t be named, hence the “youth”. Maybe I’m wrong, but if he/she is old enough to decide to take those kinds of actions on their own, they’re certainly “old enough” to deal with the publicity. They certainly weren’t shy about getting out in front of Toronto and the world and making asses of themselves.
This was in addition to arrests made on July 16th:
Police said Friday they have laid charges of assault, mischief and theft over $5,000 against Cody Caplette, 21, and Phillip Lee, 28. Both men are Toronto residents
And earlier:
Peter Hopperton is one of about 20 people identified as part of a police investigation into activities of people planning violent G20 action.
Police allege Hopperton is a member of the Southern Ontario Anarchist Resistance.
William Vandreil also got bail today, with his set at $50,000.
As well as this:
A man caught on tape damaging a police car was arrested July 14 after turning himself into police with his lawyer. He was one of six people identified after images of vandals were released on July 7. Three were identified within 12 hours.
Ashran Ravindhraj, 25, of Toronto, was charged with arson and two counts of mischief over $5,000 in relation to damage done to a police scout car on June 25.
I don’t know if these thugs truly appreciate how lucky they are that we live in a country that respects the rule of law, even if they do not. They are safe in our jails, they are safe from the public, and they are safe from vigilantes.
Now, I’m sure that in the days ahead we will hear all sorts of weepy, tear-jerking stories about how hard of a life these guys had. The “hug-a-thug” crowd will try to make a case that their anger and violent behaviour is actually the fault of society insofar that society as a whole has failed them and didn’t provide them with sufficient opportunity blah blah blah….pardon me while I puke.
Too harsh? I don’t think so. In fact, I think that’s part of the problem.
Too often we (the afore mentioned “society”), do not speak out hard or loud enough to condemn this kind of behaviour and give quarter and sufferance to those who would seek to place the blame anywhere but upon the shoulders of the individuals who made the choice to take the violent route, knowing full well that such behaviour is wrong. They’re not 2 year old infants who haven’t developed the reasoning skills necessary to determine the difference between right and wrong.
I’m all for throwing the book at them. Charge them, and if found guilty, punish them to the full extent of the law. The message needs to be sent loud and clear across the land: This kind of behaviour is unacceptable in this country, and those who engage in such lawless activities will face the full force of our justice system.
Contrary to popular belief (albeit with good reason through demonstration in recent history), our Justice System actually does have teeth. Unfortunately, thanks to the hug-a-thug loons out there, it’s considered uncivilized for it to bear it’s teeth and take a bite out of crime. No no no, we can’t have our justice system feared! How déclassé! To think that there are those who believe that criminals and deviants should fear the consequences of their actions! How barbaric! No no, let us take them into our arms, show them that they are loved and have value…[end sarc]… good lord, I think I’m going to puke again.
There is right, and there is wrong. Sure there’s shades of grey, but really, grey is still dirtier than white. There are also consequences for actions. These, dare I say men, knew that they were acting in the wrong and they need to know those consequences. I can’t dream of any excuse for what they and others did that day other than a desire to be violent.
I’m disgusted by their actions, nearly to the point of physical illness. And I’m not alone.
I am not going to give you a weepy tale about how hard of a life those captives had but I will tell you how easy of a life the police have: they create the problem and they get paid to “solve” it themselves.
What a great gig! On top of that, they get to beat people up with a fire-arm at their hip! Talk about courageous!
Nobody forced the hooligans to vandalize or burn or otherwise destroy. They did it of their own volition and deserve to be punished accordingly.
I lament only that the hoodlums will be punished to the full extent of Canadian law, which is mild compared to punishments meted out in other nations, even stateside.
I do not disagree that those that actually participated in destructive activities deserve the full force of the law. That being said: You can not tell me that the Popo did not take a power/ego trip and make stuff up along the way, obstruct civil liberties during this manufactured piece of theater.
I also find it rather interesting that folks have missed the whole point of this little exercise: If you have civil rights and liberties that can be repealed by a government in secret, with out consultation of the sitting democratically elected members, with out notification, then you my dear fellow slave have NO RIGHTS that can be counted on except at the whim and sufferance of your present owner.
Enjoy!
Well, the intent of this post has nothing to do with the police themselves.
While I’m not going to be drawn into an extended argument about the conduct and powers that were given to the police by Dalton McGuinty, I will say that I agree that some police officers may have gotten carried away with the powers that were given to them, but I refuse to paint the entire group with the same brush.
This post was only about the thugs that decided to take advantage of or instigate the chaos, knowing full well that their actions were dangerous and unlawful, and the likely soft-touch they’ll get thanks to the bleeding-heart hug-a-thug groups who seek daily to defang and declaw our courts and turn them into toothless creatures that merely gum those who come across their path.
Civil rights and liberties can only be replaced if the people allow them to be. Resorting to anarchist violence is not an acceptable response.
I respect those people who were exercising their civil liberties in peacefully demonstrating as a show of support for their commonly held beliefs.
I have no respect, sympathy or sufferance for the thugs who used this event as an opportunity to be destructive.
Why not?
Sean,
If you want extravagant security, did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, you should pay for it yourself?
I do not live in Toronto and the destruction of that city is as distant to me as is the looting that goes on in earthquake-ravaged Haiti.
One thing I do know is that hot-dog and chip vendors were pushed out of town so that a bunch of parasitic civil servants could party it up on my dime. That does not sound fair to me. In fact, it sounds so unfair that I think a revolution is in order.
It is high time that the elite start looking behind their backs as they spend the money confiscated from the working class.
Charles! Are you calling for a worker uprising?
If I ever lean to the right, it’s on law enforcement. However, the grey lady raises an important point.
As I recall, the rioting and damage was done on one day, and then the next day the police joined in on the thuggery and attacked a peaceful group singing our national anthem.
It just points to the incompetence. There was clearly a case for law enforcement to step in and arrests the arsons and thugs and chose to do nothing (I guess they kept the tapes and continue to make arrests now).
Then the next day, with the whole world watching, the police arrest hundreds of innocent people (some of whom were simply commuting to work!).
One day, we grant incredible liberties to a group of thugs, only to revoke these same rights a day later to a group of peaceful demonstrators. It’s no wonder Iran lectured us on human rights issues. What an embarassment.
Charles, do whatever you feel you need to do, and then I expect you to be held accountable for those actions. It’s called ownership and taking personal responsibility for your actions. I’ve never known for you to advocate open and anarchist violence, but if that’s your way, you’d deserve whatever comes to you as a result of it, just as these thugs do. Democracy and civil society has already outlawed that kind of behaviour, and those laws have yet to be sufficiently challenged to overturn them.
Clearly, you and I will never agree on the amount of ‘government’ (since you seem to believe there should be none) and your personal bias against any form of public authority skews your views in that direction. I accept that, but I also expect people to be realistic. Your vision of a purely libertarian society will never happen. Human nature just won’t allow it. As such, you are bound to the same expectations to live within the law that the rest of us are.
If you feel so strongly about it, and you believe your beliefs have sufficient support, please feel free to try and change it.
And, as far as I recall, revolutions involve a rebellion against something or someone, with the focus of ‘violence’ restricted to that target and it’s support network. Anarchist violence is simply violence for the sake of violence with no intended target or focus, just whatever happens to sway the anarchist or catch their attention.
RD,
So, does that make what the rioters did okay? I grant that the police overreacted in being proactive the following day rather than reactive. But I still don’t think that justifies the actions of the thugs.
Damn straight, Sean. Now they just got to nab the worst offender.
(On a side note, we have protections for minors that commit crimes for a reason. I don’t think the ability to hurl a brick at a police car is an indicator of sufficient maturity to be treated as an adult.)
Great post, I couldn’t agree more. If you can’t do the time, don’t do the crime.
How many of these malcontents will think twice before participating and shielding criminal activity?
In a few cases peaceful protesters were seen telling the masked individuals to not march with them. Can you imagine if more of these peaceful protesters acted with a civic duty to protect each other from criminal activity. Some citizens did not stand by and video tape or provide a shield, they got involved and tried to stop the violence.
Remember those people who directed traffic when we had that Blackout?
There are some individuals in our society who will stand up for what’s right and take the initiative to do what’s necessary to get the job done in times of confusion. If only there were more of those people in society today. It might actually be a better place.
“So, does that make what the rioters did okay?”
Sean, you put words in my mouth.
My next paragraph had the following line “There was clearly a case for law enforcement to step in and arrests the arsons and thugs and chose to do nothing”
Lets not stoop to fabricating positions that don’t exist simply because we argue all day.
I wasn’t trying to put words in your mouth with that question. I was genuinely asking because I thought there was a qualifier there regarding the police behaving the same way the following day. Misunderstanding on my part there. Sorry.
I’m trying to keep the police out of this particular discussion because I believe that it’s a separate issue and a separate discussion that other people are carrying on quite well without me.
Whether the police had the right or wrong powers and whether or not some of them went into this event with totally the wrong attitude isn’t really relevant to what’s going to happen to the violent protesters now.
Whether or not the violence broke out is only peripherally related to it because until that time, the police had not overtly exercised the full weight of their authority and there was no guarantee that they would either.
The whole point of my post is that there are people in this country who believe that anarchist violence is acceptable and justifiable. And now that they’ve been caught and will be facing charges, I’m concerned that the severity of their actions and the message it sends will be lost beneath the angst and hand-wringing over ‘the state of their lives that pushed them to be such angry people’ etc etc etc which will ultimately undermine justice and excuse their behaviour and send a different message than the one that needs to be sent; which to my mind is that they were engaging in domestic terrorism.
I actually enjoy your participation RD, you contribute to the conversation, and that’s what I’m after. And I think that more than once we’ve agreed on certain issues in the past.
Sean,
If there is hand-wringing over the state of their lives that pushed them to be such angry people, then your side wins.
Those protesters are not protesting just because they are blindly angry. They actually have a message.
Hey Charles,
I’m not sure what you mean when you say that my side wins if there’s hand-wringing. Could you clarify that? Because from my perspective, I’m not so sure that any hand-wringing is genuine concern and not some sort of performance by social-activists using the situation to draw attention to their cause.
I have no problem with protesters being angry. Often they have a reason to be, at least in their minds if no one else’s. That’s why they’re protesting. I respect that and encourage it. Freedom of Expression et al. Peaceful protest.
However I will always draw the line at allowing that protest to escalate into violence. When it crosses that line, it becomes either rebellion or terrorism depending on what direction it takes. At that point, it’s no longer a protest; it’s an assault. A direct challenge like that demands a response that doesn’t further their cause unless they believe in martyrdom and take it that far. And for that, they’d have to truly push the envelope.
“…anarchist violence is not an acceptable response.” I have a mixed view on this when it comes to a total tyranny government that needs to be challenged.
This isn’t the case, but the Boston TeaParty is a good example of damaging personal goods so, are we saying it should not have happened?
The Boston Tea Party was about No Taxation Without Representation. Britain had levied a tax against a foreign nation which violated their Constitution insofar that only an elected representative could collect taxes on behalf of the government, and as the British Colonies in America had no representative in the British House of Commons, they didn’t recognize their authority to collect taxes from them. This resulted in the destruction of a related product which was at the center of the conflict. It wasn’t random, or anarchist. It was focused and it was deliberate.
Now, had they gone on to destroy the wharves nearby ships and warehouses storing other items, THAT would have been anarchist.
Haven’t seen you in a while SilverFox. Welcome back!
“There is right, and there is wrong. Sure there’s shades of grey, but really, grey is still dirtier than white. There are also consequences for actions. These, dare I say men, knew that they were acting in the wrong and they need to know those consequences. I can’t dream of any excuse for what they and others did that day other than a desire to be violent.”
“They and others” being the cops who beat the crap out of peaceful protestors, right? Or are you only a law-and-order type when it comes to vandalism?
Idiot vandals ran free and peaceful protestors got locked up and beat up. Do the goddamn math and stop thinking like an AM radio talk show host.
Sean,
I would encourage you to focus on what actually happened.
What happened was this:
Day 1: Violence broke out as a result of people dressed in black constumes while the police stood by watching, scratching their balls.
Day 2: No violence but the police tricked passers-by into being corralled and sent them to detention.
Yet, the mysterious people dressed in black are nowhere to be found. How do they elude the police???????????????
We may as well hire more civil servants to stop traffic so that they can dig ditches and fill them up again.