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	<title>Comments on: We Demand a Public Inquiry into Torture</title>
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	<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/</link>
	<description>Conservative group weblog that publishes daily commentary on political events and topics affecting Canada, the United States and the world.</description>
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		<title>By: balbulican</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214011</link>
		<dc:creator>balbulican</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 14:54:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214011</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think that&#039;s correct, Mark. The allegation is that information was communicated by a diplomat to political superiors, not members of the Armed Forces.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s correct, Mark. The allegation is that information was communicated by a diplomat to political superiors, not members of the Armed Forces.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Peters</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214010</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Peters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 14:40:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214010</guid>
		<description>For the military stuff, use the military police investigators.  If they find grounds for prosecution or further investigation then perhaps uncork an inquiry.  If the MP finds no evidence that information was hidden or truncated or otherwise then this cuts the allegations off at the knees and saves taxpayers millions.

As for the war of words currently going on, General Rick Hillier carries MUCH more weight with me than Richard Colvin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the military stuff, use the military police investigators.  If they find grounds for prosecution or further investigation then perhaps uncork an inquiry.  If the MP finds no evidence that information was hidden or truncated or otherwise then this cuts the allegations off at the knees and saves taxpayers millions.</p>
<p>As for the war of words currently going on, General Rick Hillier carries MUCH more weight with me than Richard Colvin.</p>
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		<title>By: balbulican</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214006</link>
		<dc:creator>balbulican</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 17:32:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214006</guid>
		<description>&quot;admit that most of this hue and cry is primarily nothing more than just another attempt at “gotcha!” politics by the libranos, in yet another attempt to diminish the present government carried out under the guise of what we are to believe is true concern.&quot;

Since this statement can and has been used by Conservative supporters to dismiss all criticism on any issue (as it was used by the Liberals before that), it doesn&#039;t carry much force in this instance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;admit that most of this hue and cry is primarily nothing more than just another attempt at “gotcha!” politics by the libranos, in yet another attempt to diminish the present government carried out under the guise of what we are to believe is true concern.&#8221;</p>
<p>Since this statement can and has been used by Conservative supporters to dismiss all criticism on any issue (as it was used by the Liberals before that), it doesn&#8217;t carry much force in this instance.</p>
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		<title>By: balbulican</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214005</link>
		<dc:creator>balbulican</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 16:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214005</guid>
		<description>So Bec...in this democracy that we both value, you don&#039;t feel that  should governments are accountable for their actions? Interesting interpretation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So Bec&#8230;in this democracy that we both value, you don&#8217;t feel that  should governments are accountable for their actions? Interesting interpretation.</p>
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		<title>By: old white guy</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214002</link>
		<dc:creator>old white guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214002</guid>
		<description>no more prisoners. shot first bury second.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no more prisoners. shot first bury second.</p>
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		<title>By: Bec</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214001</link>
		<dc:creator>Bec</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 12:39:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214001</guid>
		<description>&quot;I’m searching through the ranting and raving above for a coherent argument against an inquiry, and I have to say there isn’t a single point worth addressing.&quot; 

So sign the petition, balbulican. That&#039;s democracy. The same thing that our soldiers are giving up their lives to enable the Afghans to embrace, experience and enjoy.
While you&#039;re at it, remove yourself from your soap box suggesting that only you, provide a &#039;coherent argument&#039;.
You, like every other poster at this site, simply provided an opinion and position, nothing less and nothing more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’m searching through the ranting and raving above for a coherent argument against an inquiry, and I have to say there isn’t a single point worth addressing.&#8221; </p>
<p>So sign the petition, balbulican. That&#8217;s democracy. The same thing that our soldiers are giving up their lives to enable the Afghans to embrace, experience and enjoy.<br />
While you&#8217;re at it, remove yourself from your soap box suggesting that only you, provide a &#8216;coherent argument&#8217;.<br />
You, like every other poster at this site, simply provided an opinion and position, nothing less and nothing more.</p>
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		<title>By: TangoJuliette</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-214000</link>
		<dc:creator>TangoJuliette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:00:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-214000</guid>
		<description>Do it.
 
Put Iggnatieff in as sitting Judge. 

Have a tome of his pro-G.W. Bush writings supporting torture serve as The Book used for the swearing in f witnesses.

Otherwise, admit that most of this hue and cry is primarily nothing more than just another attempt at &quot;gotcha!&quot; politics by the libranos, in yet another attempt to diminish the present government carried out under the guise of what we are to believe is true concern. 

Tears? The libs crank &#039;em out on demand.

My crocodile is most envious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do it.</p>
<p>Put Iggnatieff in as sitting Judge. </p>
<p>Have a tome of his pro-G.W. Bush writings supporting torture serve as The Book used for the swearing in f witnesses.</p>
<p>Otherwise, admit that most of this hue and cry is primarily nothing more than just another attempt at &#8220;gotcha!&#8221; politics by the libranos, in yet another attempt to diminish the present government carried out under the guise of what we are to believe is true concern. </p>
<p>Tears? The libs crank &#8216;em out on demand.</p>
<p>My crocodile is most envious.</p>
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		<title>By: balbulican</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213999</link>
		<dc:creator>balbulican</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 10:48:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213999</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m searching through the ranting and raving above for a coherent argument against an inquiry, and I have to say there isn&#039;t a single point worth addressing. 

A Canadian diplomat with a sound reputation has made two allegations: that Canadian forces handed over detainees into custody where torture was probable, and that his attempts to inform his superiors and others responsible for decision making were ignored. 

The first is at least a violation of Canadian policy, and at worst a war crime. The second is evidence of incompetence or dishonesty. 

The Conservative defense against these accusations has been that the data is unreliable, plus some pretty appalling attacks on a professional diplomat.

Obviously the accusations are unproven. But (a) they matter, and (b), they are provable. That&#039;s why an inquiry is needed. When you call 911 to report an incident, they don&#039;t refuse to investigate because you have no evidence. Their job is do investigate what happened.

Oddly, none of the opponents have actually disputed the fact that torture occurs in Afghan custody, that Canadians most likely knew about it, or that the diplomat in question was (until McKay started sliming him) a respected professional. Instead we&#039;re hearing rants about Tamils and Taliban and loving our country and Olivia Chow - the kind of defensive rage that usually signals the absence of a real defense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m searching through the ranting and raving above for a coherent argument against an inquiry, and I have to say there isn&#8217;t a single point worth addressing. </p>
<p>A Canadian diplomat with a sound reputation has made two allegations: that Canadian forces handed over detainees into custody where torture was probable, and that his attempts to inform his superiors and others responsible for decision making were ignored. </p>
<p>The first is at least a violation of Canadian policy, and at worst a war crime. The second is evidence of incompetence or dishonesty. </p>
<p>The Conservative defense against these accusations has been that the data is unreliable, plus some pretty appalling attacks on a professional diplomat.</p>
<p>Obviously the accusations are unproven. But (a) they matter, and (b), they are provable. That&#8217;s why an inquiry is needed. When you call 911 to report an incident, they don&#8217;t refuse to investigate because you have no evidence. Their job is do investigate what happened.</p>
<p>Oddly, none of the opponents have actually disputed the fact that torture occurs in Afghan custody, that Canadians most likely knew about it, or that the diplomat in question was (until McKay started sliming him) a respected professional. Instead we&#8217;re hearing rants about Tamils and Taliban and loving our country and Olivia Chow &#8211; the kind of defensive rage that usually signals the absence of a real defense.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213998</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 05:17:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213998</guid>
		<description>Maher Arar got $12 million of OUR tax dollars for &quot;Alleged&quot; harm by his homeland of Syria , the weasel didin&#039;t even have the guts to appear at the Inquiry named after him.
 But , just go over the list of pro-Islamists at the Arar inquiry and see the same bunch of Anti-west CAIR friendly Whahhabi org.s that Sheem Khan was tied to when she and CAIR  crusaded for Shariah law in canada.

 Too bad all these Human Rights idiots don&#039;t focus on the Homour killings in canada of Female Muslims rather than their Misogynistic leftist tripe to care more about Muslim males in Afghanistan.
 Since Afghanistan is 99.9% Muslim and they freely murder gays and Unionists, let do what Amnesty wants and pull-out to let them slaughter each other for Allah to sort out the REAL muslims.
Hams,Hezboallh and Tamil Tiger supporters are free to use children as Human Shields in Toronto during protests while even Olivia Chow and David Miller refuse to condemn this child abuse.
 The   Legal-War  deniers keep spewing out vague Allegations based on forcing people to prove a negative that it didn&#039;t happen.
  
 Hey wait, Martin and Chretien have never denied that 9/11 was an inside job, and McGuinty has never denied the Roswell crash where Aliens are held in area 51.

 Ergo....it must be true since they won&#039;t hold an Inquiry to prove it is false.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maher Arar got $12 million of OUR tax dollars for &#8220;Alleged&#8221; harm by his homeland of Syria , the weasel didin&#8217;t even have the guts to appear at the Inquiry named after him.<br />
 But , just go over the list of pro-Islamists at the Arar inquiry and see the same bunch of Anti-west CAIR friendly Whahhabi org.s that Sheem Khan was tied to when she and CAIR  crusaded for Shariah law in canada.</p>
<p> Too bad all these Human Rights idiots don&#8217;t focus on the Homour killings in canada of Female Muslims rather than their Misogynistic leftist tripe to care more about Muslim males in Afghanistan.<br />
 Since Afghanistan is 99.9% Muslim and they freely murder gays and Unionists, let do what Amnesty wants and pull-out to let them slaughter each other for Allah to sort out the REAL muslims.<br />
Hams,Hezboallh and Tamil Tiger supporters are free to use children as Human Shields in Toronto during protests while even Olivia Chow and David Miller refuse to condemn this child abuse.<br />
 The   Legal-War  deniers keep spewing out vague Allegations based on forcing people to prove a negative that it didn&#8217;t happen.</p>
<p> Hey wait, Martin and Chretien have never denied that 9/11 was an inside job, and McGuinty has never denied the Roswell crash where Aliens are held in area 51.</p>
<p> Ergo&#8230;.it must be true since they won&#8217;t hold an Inquiry to prove it is false.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan McLeod</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213997</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan McLeod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 04:43:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213997</guid>
		<description>If we are to complain about costs, why aren&#039;t we complaining about the costs of the war?

If we are to complain about the costs of investigating criminal activity, why are we focused on this rather than the &quot;war on drugs&quot;?  What about insider trading?

If we are to be so concerned about the costs of enforcing Canadian law, why have any legislation at all?

If we are concerned about our troops, why should we not be concerned that officials may have made them unwitting facilitators of torture?

If we are to support our troops, we should support their &lt;a href=&quot;http://cannedgoodsandammunition.blogspot.com/2009/09/when-soldiers-try-to-do-right-thing.html&quot;&gt;attempts to do the right thing&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If we are to complain about costs, why aren&#8217;t we complaining about the costs of the war?</p>
<p>If we are to complain about the costs of investigating criminal activity, why are we focused on this rather than the &#8220;war on drugs&#8221;?  What about insider trading?</p>
<p>If we are to be so concerned about the costs of enforcing Canadian law, why have any legislation at all?</p>
<p>If we are concerned about our troops, why should we not be concerned that officials may have made them unwitting facilitators of torture?</p>
<p>If we are to support our troops, we should support their <a href="http://cannedgoodsandammunition.blogspot.com/2009/09/when-soldiers-try-to-do-right-thing.html">attempts to do the right thing</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: wilson</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213996</link>
		<dc:creator>wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 03:51:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213996</guid>
		<description>The General&#039;s interrogations tomorrow will go a long way at bringing everyone back to reality.
The Opps will look like the witch hunters they are.

There will be no inquiry.
But it a good opportunity to remind Canadians that Iffy is ok with a little torture and a few targetted assassinations.

And an equally good opportunity to illustrate how the new Harper government, handled situtations in a far far superior way than did the chretien/martin governments.

Chretien had been in government 8 years when we went to war in Afghanistan.
And it took the Libs 3 years and 11 months to draft a handover agreement, from the time  the  first prisoner was captured Jan 2002 to Dec 2005, there was no agreement, zip, free for all, take these prisons, walk away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The General&#8217;s interrogations tomorrow will go a long way at bringing everyone back to reality.<br />
The Opps will look like the witch hunters they are.</p>
<p>There will be no inquiry.<br />
But it a good opportunity to remind Canadians that Iffy is ok with a little torture and a few targetted assassinations.</p>
<p>And an equally good opportunity to illustrate how the new Harper government, handled situtations in a far far superior way than did the chretien/martin governments.</p>
<p>Chretien had been in government 8 years when we went to war in Afghanistan.<br />
And it took the Libs 3 years and 11 months to draft a handover agreement, from the time  the  first prisoner was captured Jan 2002 to Dec 2005, there was no agreement, zip, free for all, take these prisons, walk away.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213995</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 03:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213995</guid>
		<description>I agree with Rob C.  

Why should the Canadian tax payers pay so that a bunch of lawyers and bureaucrats can collect cheques while Parliamentarians are led around by a bunch of terrorists and their bleeding heart lackeys?  Why?  To find out that it was all for nothing?  I’ll take the word of General Rick Hillier and Peter MacKay over that of a terrorist.

If the Liberals, the NDP, the Bloc and all these amnesty groups want an inquiry, let them pay up, let them put their money where their mouth is!  

Where were they after the 9/11 and London attacks?  They weren’t calling for answers from the aggressors!  No where did I see this!  Where were they when terrorists were arrested in Toronto, and when Omar Khadr killed that soldier with a hand grenade?  Defending THEIR rights!  What about the rights of CANADIANS?  The Canadian Forces defend Canadians (by the grace of God) and now they are coming under fire by those who defend terrorists rather than their victims?!?  

Not on my dime they won’t!  I will NOT support anything like that, at least not on the word of terrorist prisoners!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Rob C.  </p>
<p>Why should the Canadian tax payers pay so that a bunch of lawyers and bureaucrats can collect cheques while Parliamentarians are led around by a bunch of terrorists and their bleeding heart lackeys?  Why?  To find out that it was all for nothing?  I’ll take the word of General Rick Hillier and Peter MacKay over that of a terrorist.</p>
<p>If the Liberals, the NDP, the Bloc and all these amnesty groups want an inquiry, let them pay up, let them put their money where their mouth is!  </p>
<p>Where were they after the 9/11 and London attacks?  They weren’t calling for answers from the aggressors!  No where did I see this!  Where were they when terrorists were arrested in Toronto, and when Omar Khadr killed that soldier with a hand grenade?  Defending THEIR rights!  What about the rights of CANADIANS?  The Canadian Forces defend Canadians (by the grace of God) and now they are coming under fire by those who defend terrorists rather than their victims?!?  </p>
<p>Not on my dime they won’t!  I will NOT support anything like that, at least not on the word of terrorist prisoners!</p>
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		<title>By: Bec</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213994</link>
		<dc:creator>Bec</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 03:29:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213994</guid>
		<description>Absolutely NOT!
 
Pay for it indeed and while they are at it, perhaps they could give as much of themselves to the pride and defense of our Canadian military as they are to some allegations of torture to enemy combatants.
These people make me so angry it is indescribable. They would rather believe the worst of their fellow Canadians and military than a few alleged, Taliban terrorists that presented as farmers.

What&#039;s going to happen in the inquiry, find the Taliban farmers?
It&#039;s WAR! We have lost our men and women, sons and daughters, fathers and mothers......friends.
Grow up, lawmakers!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Absolutely NOT!</p>
<p>Pay for it indeed and while they are at it, perhaps they could give as much of themselves to the pride and defense of our Canadian military as they are to some allegations of torture to enemy combatants.<br />
These people make me so angry it is indescribable. They would rather believe the worst of their fellow Canadians and military than a few alleged, Taliban terrorists that presented as farmers.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s going to happen in the inquiry, find the Taliban farmers?<br />
It&#8217;s WAR! We have lost our men and women, sons and daughters, fathers and mothers&#8230;&#8230;friends.<br />
Grow up, lawmakers!</p>
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		<title>By: Durward</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213993</link>
		<dc:creator>Durward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 03:00:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213993</guid>
		<description>So put your money where your mouth is and hire an investigative team, why do you need to spend tax payer dollars trying to embarrass Canada?
If there is proof put it forward, why should we pay for a witch hunt ?
It&#039;s a war not a baby sitting service and we are short manned.
PS. The Red Cross has lost all credibility yrs ago, wise up.
Take a look around, every nation in the world is behaving in an insane fashion except Canada, and you want to use resources chasing Ghosts for the Liberal party of Canada and their stooges?
Has Canada not suffered these fools enough?
Perhaps you have forgotten these scum gave up their rights under the Geneva convention when they attacked civilians and hid amongst them.
Terrorist Ambulance chasers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So put your money where your mouth is and hire an investigative team, why do you need to spend tax payer dollars trying to embarrass Canada?<br />
If there is proof put it forward, why should we pay for a witch hunt ?<br />
It&#8217;s a war not a baby sitting service and we are short manned.<br />
PS. The Red Cross has lost all credibility yrs ago, wise up.<br />
Take a look around, every nation in the world is behaving in an insane fashion except Canada, and you want to use resources chasing Ghosts for the Liberal party of Canada and their stooges?<br />
Has Canada not suffered these fools enough?<br />
Perhaps you have forgotten these scum gave up their rights under the Geneva convention when they attacked civilians and hid amongst them.<br />
Terrorist Ambulance chasers.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob C</title>
		<link>http://www.thepolitic.com/archives/2009/11/24/we-demand-a-public-inquiry-into-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-213992</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob C</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 03:00:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thepolitic.com/?p=6864#comment-213992</guid>
		<description>The folks that sign the petition can pay the expenses of the public inquiry because I do not want my tax dollars going to see if some SOB who was/is trying to kill our soldiers is comfy cozy in the slammer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The folks that sign the petition can pay the expenses of the public inquiry because I do not want my tax dollars going to see if some SOB who was/is trying to kill our soldiers is comfy cozy in the slammer.</p>
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